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Post by swampdonkeys on Oct 25, 2008 8:11:00 GMT -5
I implemented a draft lottery in the league I founded and run and I must say it was a solid decision. I feel it would make a lot of sense for this league aswell, at least for the bottom 7.
It is good for a couple of reasons. The most important being it prevents teams from tanking to try and get the 1st pick. What does everyone think?
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Post by drury2396 on Oct 25, 2008 8:50:31 GMT -5
We have a draft lottery haha.
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Post by drury2396 on Oct 25, 2008 8:53:45 GMT -5
"There will be a draft lottery to protect the integrity of the league. The bottom 5 teams will participate in the draft lottery. The exact results from the actual N.H.L. lottery shall apply to our lottery."
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Post by swampdonkeys on Oct 25, 2008 9:34:26 GMT -5
oh shit, nice. my bad.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2008 18:37:40 GMT -5
LOL, I am a moron too swamp I didn't know we had a lottery either.
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Post by swampdonkeys on Jan 31, 2009 9:40:23 GMT -5
i'm bringing this up again. how is it going to be conducted? in other words who is doing the lottery?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2009 9:43:17 GMT -5
I would think it would be the same as the original draft.
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Post by drury2396 on Jan 31, 2009 10:19:17 GMT -5
It works the same as the NHL draft, not the same as the original draft where we used a site to conduct the order.
This means that the bottom five teams in our league are paired up with the respective bottom five teams in the NHL (lottery picks are for the bottom five teams).
For instance, say Adam's team finishes last in our league. Say the Islanders finish last in the NHL. Whatever pick the Isles get in the draft lottery is the pick Adam gets. This continues for all bottom 5 teams in the league.
I hope that helps. Let me know if you have any more questions.
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Post by drury2396 on Jan 31, 2009 10:47:30 GMT -5
Fellas,
A few GM's have brought up the issue of tanking and feel this league doesn't have stringent enough rules to stop tanking. As of now, we only have the draft lottery, so that finishing last doesn't guarantee the last overall pick.
Tanking is a wierd issue for me. I know I've personally always felt that I wouldn't do it...but at the same time it has been, and always will be, a part of fantasy hockey.
If the league as a whole doesn't like it, we can bring it up. In another league I commish, we installed an "Unwritten rule - No tanking," since it's hard to make rules to cover all the bases of tanking. That's something we could definitely vote on.
The one thing I will say, though, is that I'd feel uncomfortable installing new rules for this season. For this season, atleast, I believe the lottery should to serve as the protector for tanking. It is clear some teams have plans they have laid, and technically they aren't breaking any rules
I think whatever the league decides will be best. If everyone wants, we can even make and vote on proposals now. When they go into effect, well like I've said, I feel nothing should go into action this season. But if there is an overwhelming feeling from the league that it should go into effect now, maybe that's a route we'd have to explore.
This is each and everyone of you who get to make this decision, not me. I don't want to lose GM's over this issue, especially since many active ones have had concerns with this. I'd like to hear from everybody.
Cheers, JR
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2009 11:20:48 GMT -5
Guys, I'm sure you're referring to me but am I really tanking? I have fielded the best team possible, except putting Steve Mason in (who I recently acquired no less than 2 weeks ago or so). Look at my roster moves:
Nicklas Backstrom in for empty roster spot - Goes into effect 11-15-08 Milan Lucic in for empty roster spot - Goes into effect 11-19-08 Curtis Glencross in for empty roster spot - Goes into effect 12-12-08 Anton Stralman in for empty roster spot - Goes into effect 1-3-09 Patrik Berglund in for empty roster spot - Goes into effect 1-3-09 Dainius Zubrus in for empty roster spot - Goes into effect 1-3-09 Brian Boucher in for empty roster spot - Goes into effect 1-23-09 Nikita Filatov in for empty roster spot - Goes into effect 1-23-09 T.J. Hensick in for empty roster spot - Goes into effect 1-23-09 Max Pacioretty in for empty roster spot - Goes into effect 1-23-09
I called up players like Berglund. If I was tanking, why would I call up the prospect I own that is currently producing the best? I called up Pacioretty when he began playing in the NHL as well.
I am fielding the best team possible here so I don't think there is any issue. My team just sucks. If it makes everyone happy, I'll put Mason in but that is really the only thing I can do.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2009 12:21:12 GMT -5
O.K. guys, here is where I come out on the tanking issue.
I am not stupid enough to think guys don't do it. I am also not stupid enough to think it is not being done to some degree in all leagues.
My personal take on it is go ahead and do it. How does this really help?
Let's say you get the number one pick for a few years. So what. That does not make you automatically the best team. Over half these guys end up being for shit anyway.
You can't do it forever. You will eventually end up with excellent team then you will have your run and be done. Just like everybody else. It takes most of these guys 3 or 4 years to get to where they make a serious impact anyway. By then they are 26 or 27. Then you might get 5 years at best. Then you will start to suck again. It is the way all of it is set up, NHL included.
My time along with a few others is now, the tide will turn down the road, then it will be us guys who will get the picks.
If you want to keep tanking then go ahead, I will take the money and run while your trying to work some stupid ass plan that does not really work anyway.
Let's not ruin the league or quit over something you can't do nothing about anyway.
We can putt in some rules such as games played. The lottery and so forth but will you ever stop it totally, probably not.
that's all I got to offer at this point.
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Post by swampdonkeys on Jan 31, 2009 12:22:59 GMT -5
unless you want to ruin 2 leagues in less then a month, i suggest you admit what everyone else already knows (that your tanking, for the best chance at the 1st pick) and STOP insulting everyones intelligence.
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Post by drury2396 on Jan 31, 2009 12:31:17 GMT -5
If anyone has any suggestions, we are all ears.
Swamp, the league you're referring to is an absolute joke. They thought Adam and I were they same person because we have similar e-mail addresses we made together when we were ten.
I like to think this league runs a lot smoother than most. That being said, if anyone wants to suggest any rules, go ahead.
I'm with Tim, though. If you want to tank go ahead. That being said, Adam really is fielding his best team right now outside of Mason not playing.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2009 12:37:10 GMT -5
Please tell me how I am tanking Tim and swamp?
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Post by drury2396 on Jan 31, 2009 12:41:57 GMT -5
In the other league, Adam is tanking.
In this one I think you could say he's tanking with Mason out...but after that it's just that his team is really young.
I guess you could argue the simple fact that Adam's team is so young means he is tanking, but I don't see what we could do about that. That's well within his right.
I'm not trying to take sides that's just how I see it.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2009 12:44:45 GMT -5
I didn't say you were.
My post is for tanking in general. My personal opinion.
I could care less if you are or not. I never gave it a second thought.
I didn't bring it up. J.R. wanted some input so I gave it.
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Post by drury2396 on Jan 31, 2009 13:04:44 GMT -5
Thanks for your input, Tim.
I see where you're coming from and I'm of the same frame of mind.
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Post by swampdonkeys on Jan 31, 2009 13:21:39 GMT -5
lets see. well... Adam, you currently have 611 man GP. There are teams in this very league (who have dealt with plenty of injury) who have over 900 man GP. lets use our grade 5 math skills and add 250 GP (puts you @ 866) to your total and x that by the .76 (your avg.per gm).
250x.76= 190 466+190= 656 (which puts you in a tie for 10th)
i don't care how you dress this up or what kind of spin you try and put on it, it is crystal clear what you are doing. the thing that is pissing me off is your lie at all cost attitude. this league format is not "new" to you and you are well aware of what you are doing. you are exploiting a "loop hole" that we as a league should be fixing and not trying to capitialize off of. you will simply try and hold onto the "can't make a rule mid season argument" to get what you have wanted all along "the 1st pick in 09".
i ask this; why should 13 others rights be infringed for the sake of the 1 who by rights is not playing fair? this is my suggestion and i have told JR my future in the league depends on the outcome of this matter.
adam should be automatically given the 5th pick of the lottery as punishment for a blaton tank job. he has several picks in the 09 draft so if he happens to obtain the first selection with a pick he acquired thru trade, so be it. his own pick however should not be higher then the 5th.
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Post by drury2396 on Jan 31, 2009 13:29:12 GMT -5
I see what you mean and where you're coming from.
But do you have any ideas for any solutions? I don't think we can make a rule that "Adam's pick is the fifth pick."
Like I told you in a PM, I think the best solution, if the whole league feels that tanking should be eliminated, is a "Unwritten Rule - No Tanking." GP rules and such are hard to implement. And there's ways around that. For example Adam could drop his worst prospects for players who play every game but won't get points (ex: Betts, Yelle, Grier).
Swamp I don't want you to leave the league, and I understand why you're frustrated. Let's try to work to a solution that is rational, rather than just giving Adam the fifth best pick.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2009 13:44:24 GMT -5
Can you tell me what I can do? I'm not going to drop my prospects for shit NHL players just to get my games up. It doesn't make sense for my team.
I am not tanking in this league. My team is just young. I am tanking in the other league, I'm not denying that.
You only bring me up when I'm not the only team that is far below the average amount of games played. How is giving me the 5th overall pick fair? I'm not breaking any rules and not even tanking here. I am dressing the best possible team I can.
And yes, I will hold the "can't make a rule mid season argument" because it's logical.
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Post by drury2396 on Jan 31, 2009 14:36:41 GMT -5
Alright, I set up a poll guys.
Everyone Please Vote!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2009 15:21:51 GMT -5
I don't believe Adam is tanking. It looks to me like he has a plan and is sticking to it. It would be as if I traded Crosby, EJ, Parise, and Huselius or Nabokov to each of the top four teams for their #1 draft pick and a great prospect or two. Would I be tanking or rebuilding at that point?
Plus, if a team tanks isn't he just putting his faith in hope? There are so many prospects out there. How many of them really pan out?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2009 15:27:34 GMT -5
Thanks Ed.
Not to mention I am putting in just as much money as everyone else to rebuild. It's a process. I'm not looking to leave the league just because my team isn't going to compete in the next couple years.
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Post by drury2396 on Jan 31, 2009 15:29:13 GMT -5
Make sure you vote after reading fellas.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2009 15:41:01 GMT -5
I just did as I had left the site and forgot to vote!
Your welcome , Adam.
When I first saw your team I cold not figure out why the point total was so low. Once I dug deeper and looked at your roster, prospects, an assets that is when I figured it out what you were doing.
It is not tanking. Plus I do not see how it helps. If it is true and the Islanders are tanking to get Tavares what does it matter? How long have they sucked, 10, 15 years? I think you could argue that they have sucked since 1985, the year after their last Stanley Cup.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2009 16:01:19 GMT -5
I don't believe Adam is tanking. It looks to me like he has a plan and is sticking to it. It would be as if I traded Crosby, EJ, Parise, and Huselius or Nabokov to each of the top four teams for their #1 draft pick and a great prospect or two. Would I be tanking or rebuilding at that point? Plus, if a team tanks isn't he just putting his faith in hope? There are so many prospects out there. How many of them really pan out? That is what I said all along. How many really pan out? Go ahead and have a shit team for years if you want just to get picks. Meanwhile the rest of us will win every year. I want it known that I am not or ever did or really give a shit who is tanking or wheather you are or not. I got my own team and whatever anybody else does it is not going to effect my team. When i decide to rebuild I am dumping everybody, so is that tanking if it is so be it.
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Post by drury2396 on Jan 31, 2009 16:11:21 GMT -5
One person whose been on must not have voted yet. Don't forget to vote in the main thread.
Thanks, JR
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