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Post by drury2396 on May 15, 2011 17:55:00 GMT -5
The rules as they currently stand stipulate that:
"A player will remain a prospect until he is dropped after 4 or 5 years respectively, or is called up onto a roster at any time."
This means that if a prospect is dropped for a player (clarification: to drop a prospect he must first be technically "called up" before being dropped), he cannot be drafted in future prospect drafts, even if they have played few enough games to still be labeled a prospect otherwise.
I suggest we change this rule so that prospects who are "called up" and dropped, but still have played fewer than 25 games (20 if a goalie), are allowed to be drafted in future prospects drafts.
Thoughts?
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Post by Deleted on May 15, 2011 18:13:08 GMT -5
I think the player should be eligible to be re-drafted. I like the suggested rule change.
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Post by Deleted on May 15, 2011 18:56:26 GMT -5
I agree that "dropped" prospects should be eligible to be re-drafted if they meet the draft criteria.
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Post by drury2396 on May 16, 2011 9:04:18 GMT -5
Anybody dislike this potential rule change? Tried to think of any drawbacks from this change, but I can't.
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2011 10:24:19 GMT -5
I'm ok with this rule change. Actually, it will be easier to track this kind of prospect than it is for now. We'll just need to check team's prospect lists to know if a player is still available (with the actual rule, we need to check back every past prospects draft to be sure of the availability).
Question : is the fact that a re-drafted player reset the maximum 5-year on the propsect list is an issue?
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Post by drury2396 on May 16, 2011 11:44:23 GMT -5
I don't see it as a problem that the player be given another 4 (player) to 5 (goalies) years, but the floor's open for other suggestions.
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Post by mutumbo on May 16, 2011 14:53:38 GMT -5
I definitely like the rule change. I had thought about mentioning something like this earlier in the year... I think it adds a bit more to the drafts going forward.
I think there are lots of guys right now who will be coming onto people's rosters this year, who are still 1-3 years away from the NHL... And they might very well be solid NHLers when they make it, but it's tough to have a bunch of prospects taking up your 8 bench spots.
Here's a question though...
Let's say I draft a player, and drop him only 2 years after I draft him. Can I re-draft him the following year?
Or are we thinking only players that have passed their 4 years of prospect eligiblity?
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Post by drury2396 on May 16, 2011 15:37:19 GMT -5
I definitely like the rule change. I had thought about mentioning something like this earlier in the year... I think it adds a bit more to the drafts going forward. I think there are lots of guys right now who will be coming onto people's rosters this year, who are still 1-3 years away from the NHL... And they might very well be solid NHLers when they make it, but it's tough to have a bunch of prospects taking up your 8 bench spots. Here's a question though... Let's say I draft a player, and drop him only 2 years after I draft him. Can I re-draft him the following year? Or are we thinking only players that have passed their 4 years of prospect eligiblity? Either situation would be okay.
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2011 3:36:43 GMT -5
I like it the way it is now.
Looks like I would be in the minority though.
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2011 7:42:26 GMT -5
I think we should stick with the 4 and 5 year drop periods instead of being to drop them whenever but I'm fine either way.
Are we having the prospect draft after July 1? If we are going to allow everyone to drop prospects whenever, we should push up the roster cut day to before our prospect draft. This allows the dropped prospects to be drafted this year.
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Post by drury2396 on May 17, 2011 11:28:16 GMT -5
I like it the way it is now. Looks like I would be in the minority though. Any reasons why, Tim? I was trying to think of any drawbacks and I can't.
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2011 12:22:58 GMT -5
I'm fine with the change also
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2011 14:06:28 GMT -5
I think we should stick with the 4 and 5 year drop periods instead of being to drop them whenever but I'm fine either way. Are we having the prospect draft after July 1? If we are going to allow everyone to drop prospects whenever, we should push up the roster cut day to before our prospect draft. This allows the dropped prospects to be drafted this year. I believe even though we held the inital draft during the 07-08 season, we agreed that all prospects would have status as though drafted for the 08-09 season. Thus, the oldest prospects should only have 3 years on the farm this summer. As for starting the 4/5 years over upon re-draft - I think we should allow for re-draft but only for a 2 year stretch, not the whole 4/5 years.
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Post by molson on May 17, 2011 17:49:23 GMT -5
I like the rule change. In fact that's how it's already enforced in a similar league where I'm the commish.
Like everyone's said: It makes it easier to know who's eligible and who isn't. If they guy is drafted or has been signed by an NHL team and has played less than 25 games (20 for goalies) and isn't owned by a GM, then he's up for grabs!
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2011 17:57:21 GMT -5
I like it the way it is now. Looks like I would be in the minority though. Any reasons why, Tim? I was trying to think of any drawbacks and I can't. I don't like the thought of dropping a guy then turning right around and redrafting him locking him up for another 4 years. The way it is now, you are forced into a decision with these guys. I would allow them to be picked up via waiver wire if they are dropped but I would make them be put on the active roster. I would not like them to be able to be redrafted and be allowed to be stashed again for another lengthly period of time. It just seems like a easy way to keep guys stashed for longer than are orginal rule.
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Post by drury2396 on May 17, 2011 18:55:04 GMT -5
Any reasons why, Tim? I was trying to think of any drawbacks and I can't. I don't like the thought of dropping a guy then turning right around and redrafting him locking him up for another 4 years. The way it is now, you are forced into a decision with these guys. I would allow them to be picked up via waiver wire if they are dropped but I would make them be put on the active roster. I would not like them to be able to be redrafted and be allowed to be stashed again for another lengthly period of time. It just seems like a easy way to keep guys stashed for longer than are orginal rule. To me, that's all part of the strategy. If somebody drops someone, hoping to re-draft them in the summer, there is a huge risk that one of 13 other GM's take them. That's how I look at it anyway.
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Post by drury2396 on May 17, 2011 19:42:27 GMT -5
I'm fine with being able to drop prospects before their eligibility is up. Let me clarify - I don't think prospects should be allowed to be dropped BEFORE their four or five year window is up. If other people would rather we allow prospects to be at anytime, though, I would be okay with that, too. I mis-read this post: Here's a question though... Let's say I draft a player, and drop him only 2 years after I draft him. Can I re-draft him the following year? Or are we thinking only players that have passed their 4 years of prospect eligiblity? I think they should only be dropped upon four, or in the case of goalies five, years.
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2011 19:43:03 GMT -5
I agree with Tim. I don't want prospects being dropped early and then re-drafted with extra eligibility.
JR's initial post was about prospects being dropped because they are losing eligibility - and then them being eligible to be drafted. This wouldn't matter this year though because prospects aren't losing eligibility this offseason.
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Post by drury2396 on May 17, 2011 20:04:37 GMT -5
Here is what I am suggesting, just to be clear:
1. Prospects who are "called up" and dropped, but still have played fewer than 25 games (20 if a goalie), are allowed to be drafted in future prospects drafts.
2. Prospects who have been dropped will have their four (or five, if a goalie) year statuses reset upon being re-drafted.
3. (Just to be clear) Prospects cannot be randomly dropped for the sole purpose of redrafting them in future prospects draft. For example, say during roster cuts I decide to drop Roman Wick (for nobody), who was drafted in 2010, with the sole purpose of redrafting him this prospects draft. THIS WOULD BE ILLEGAL. If, however, I dropped Wick for a free agent during the season, then redrafted him during the next prospect draft, THIS WOULD BE LEGAL.
Is this clear for everybody? I know that talking to Adam, we each have interpreted posts by mutumbo and kozziemotto differently, so I want to try to make what I'm suggesting as clear as possible.
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2011 20:06:28 GMT -5
Here is what I am suggesting, just to be clear: 1. Prospects who are "called up" and dropped, but still have played fewer than 25 games (20 if a goalie), are allowed to be drafted in future prospects drafts. 2. Prospects who have been dropped will have their four (or five, if a goalie) year statuses reset upon being re-drafted. 3. (Just to be clear) Prospects cannot be randomly dropped for the sole purpose of redrafting them in future prospects draft. For example, say during roster cuts I decide to drop Roman Wick (for nobody), who was drafted in 2010, with the sole purpose of redrafting him this prospects draft. THIS WOULD BE ILLEGAL. If, however, I dropped Wick for a free agent during the season, then redrafted him during the next prospect draft, THIS WOULD BE LEGAL. Is this clear for everybody? I know that talking to Adam, we each have interpreted posts by mutumbo and kozziemotto differently, so I want to try to make what I'm suggesting as clear as possible. I agree.
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Post by drury2396 on May 17, 2011 21:05:33 GMT -5
Guys, please check out the other thread in hockey suggestions and vote on this.
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Post by mutumbo on Sept 28, 2011 17:43:42 GMT -5
Hey, quick clarification...
As of this summer, any prospect drafted in the "2008 Prospects Draft" or "2007 Inaugural Prospects Draft" are to be considered part of our active rosters, correct? Meaning that come draft day next Summer some people will be dropping 10+ players if that's the case. And after that draft is finished all prospects from the "2009 prospects draft" will be called up to the roster.
Is that how it works? For some reason I'm having a heck of a time figuring this complicated 4 year rule with my limited high school education.
Thanks
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2011 18:41:53 GMT -5
I think it is 2008 by next draft. Then 09 the following and so on and so forth. I also have a limited H.S. education though.
LOL
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2011 20:14:57 GMT -5
I thought we had to make a decision on our 2007 prospects before next season?
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Post by Little Bacon (Commissioner) on Sept 29, 2011 0:10:36 GMT -5
I thought we had to make a decision on our 2007 prospects before next season? This was my thought as well, that this is the final season for 07 pickees.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2011 4:29:25 GMT -5
I think I read somewhere though that since we started with half the year over we had an extra half year with the inaugral picks.
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Post by mutumbo on Sept 29, 2011 12:05:42 GMT -5
I think I read somewhere though that since we started with half the year over we had an extra half year with the inaugral picks. Yeah I remember that too, which is why we didn't have to drop 2007 prospects this past summer (or so I thought). 2007 prospects were grouped together with 2008 prospects, who we've had on our rosters for 4 years now. 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011. So this coming summer (2012) we'll have to drop 07 and 08 prospects before our 2012 draft. I think??
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Post by molson on Sept 29, 2011 12:34:21 GMT -5
In my understanding Mutumbo is 100% right
2007 (inaugural prospects) & Summer 2008 draft picks are essentially on all of our main rosters right now, because this is their 4th year.
2008-2009 - 1st year 2009-2010 - 2nd year 2010-2011 - 3rd year 2011-2012 - 4th year
That means this summer on July 1st people will be dropping a lot of players.
In fact every year from now on we'll be dropping approximately the same number of players as get drafted every year. This year will be particularly heavy since we have both the summer 2008 draft picks as well as the inaugural draft picks.
Hope that makes sense.
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Post by molson on Sept 29, 2011 12:36:07 GMT -5
PS - Those numbers don't apply to goalies since they're 5 years and not 4... so Inaugural Draft/2008 draft pick goalies will be protected for 1 more summer.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2011 15:05:59 GMT -5
Maybe I'm wrong but I understand these prospects (other than goalies) are still protect for this year - 4th year, then we will have to make annual roster cut on July 1st on our active roster (including farm but not prospects) and after that, all our 2008 prospects will be active players for 2012-2013.
So no prospect drop in 2012, but a lot of roster cuts to come in july 2013.
Probably JR will need to put something clear about it.
HF
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